POLL Advice for beginners: manual mode or one of the (semi) automated modes (Tv, Av, P, AUTO even)?

[Levina de Ruijter]

i based my response on the fact i kind of really got going with an AE-1 with film. you cant really see right away if you have bad shots and while i rarely use automation now with my digital, getting an entire roll of film back a day or a week or more from the lab to find every thing is wrong, is very disheartening.

Oh God, don't I know it! I bought a Ricoh camera in the 80's. Turned one of my closets into a darkroom, did a course on how to develop my own film, borrowed an enlarger from a friend. But learning was so hard because by the time I finally had the photos I had forgotten how I took them. An taking notes also didn't work because I made mistakes and then the notes didn't correspond to the shots any more. I gave it up. Digital cameras are a blessing!

i use Auto ISO all the time for football (american) high school stadiums are notoriously dark. i pick the shutter speed i need for stopping action, almost wide open (1/3 stop closed) so i can have a tiny teeny margin of dof and then because until about half way through the game there is light and dark areas as the sun sets and lights come up, i can be assured my photos are (usually) within 1 stop of being correct.... thats really the only time i use Auto ISO. i got that tip from a former UPI photographer who covered the Seattle Seahawks NFL team

Sounds like a good strategy.

I will try out auto ISO next time. I need to look how to set the maximum ISO as I don't want it to go crazy high. I'll try with ISO 6400 max. See how that goes.

 

[Jan1977]

DOF, motion blur, subject separation and what have you are the next step in my opinion and I don't think it matters much in which mode you are when you start experimenting with them, in manual mode or in one of the semi-automated modes.

I am mainly talking proper exposure here or rather I'm talking about light itself. I think you need to be in fully manual mode to get a grasp of it. Although I am aware that different people learn in different ways, how do you learn about light when the camera does the work for you? If the camera suddenly stops down the aperture with 1/3 of a stop would a beginner know why that happened, what changed in the light to have the camera make that adjustment? Or would they even notice it?

When we are strictly speaking on learning exposure to learn the concept of the exposure triangle, then manual mode can be a logical choice. But I imagine that to be more like taking 'test shots' of a same scene, while altering the aperture, shutterspeed and ISO to see the effect of each. If I had to explain someone the exposure triangle in practical terms, I would set the camera to M and show how I alter a setting and explain how one would see the result thereof.

 

[Jan1977]

i based my response on the fact i kind of really got going with an AE-1 with film. you cant really see right away if you have bad shots and while i rarely use automation now with my digital, getting an entire roll of film back a day or a week or more from the lab to find every thing is wrong, is very disheartening.

i use Auto ISO all the time for football (american) high school stadiums are notoriously dark. i pick the shutter speed i need for stopping action, almost wide open (1/3 stop closed) so i can have a tiny teeny margin of dof and then because until about half way through the game there is light and dark areas as the sun sets and lights come up, i can be assured my photos are (usually) within 1 stop of being correct.... thats really the only time i use Auto ISO. i got that tip from a former UPI photographer who covered the Seattle Seahawks NFL team

I pretty much always use M-mode with auto-ISO since shooting mirrorless as I can see the exposure in the EVF. With sports there are some more shaded parts or sunny parts of the pitch, when clouds are drifting by influencing the amount of sun hitting the scene or at when at night, light levels of the floodlights are not uniform around the pitch. I feel like the camera almost always gets a decent enough exposure and in post I can make some slight adjustments when needed by turning the exposure slider.
In sunny daylight I often pick a higher shutterspeed, to get the auto-ISO to get to around 400-800. That way I can be pretty sure that it does not lead to overexposure when it couldn't go lower than 100 ISO with a sudden extra amount of light.
When I do some birding I usually remain in M-mode. If there is a scene where I think auto-ISO does not give a proper result, I set the ISO as well.

If I do some flash work in controlled environments I shoot full manual setting all 3 parameters.

When using auto-ISO I think a lot of people tend to use exposure compensation to guide the metering. I know the concept, but hardly ever really use exposure compensation myself. If I was to shoot a scene where it mattered, I would use it but for most of my shooting until now did not really require it. I do chimp every now and then to check on my histograms.

 

[Levina de Ruijter]

When we are strictly speaking on learning exposure to learn the concept of the exposure triangle, then manual mode can be a logical choice. But I imagine that to be more like taking 'test shots' of a same scene, while altering the aperture, shutterspeed and ISO to see the effect of each. If I had to explain someone the exposure triangle in practical terms, I would set the camera to M and show how I alter a setting and explain how one would see the result thereof.

I don't think that taking "test shots" and then seeing/explaining what different settings do, will learn a person much. I mean, sure, learn the theory but it's something very different from having a camera in your hands and trying to get the exposure right. I think it's through actually using a camera that you learn. And then it becomes kinda intuitive.

I remember when I had my Ricoh, a friend of mine lent me a book about the basics of photography. I read about exposure and DOF and subject separation and although I obviously understood what I read, it had little relevance to what happened when I actually picked up a camera. I had to experience it myself. I gave up photography back then as the whole process with film was not my thing. I bought the 40D in 2010 and then really learned how to properly expose my shots as the EXIF was embedded with each file. That was a tremendous help. But it still took many months before working the dials on the camera became a second nature, knowing instinctively almost which setting I wanted to change and why: aperture, shutter speed or ISO. You can't learn that from a book or a teacher, I don't think.

Since I have only shot in manual mode, I don't think I quite understand exposure compensation, so maybe I have this all wrong, but if you have to turn a dial to compensate for overexposure or underexposure for a given setting, then what is the difference with manual where you do the same?

 

[pcs]

I didn't like auto-ISO to start with but when it became better and exp. comp. became possible(I think with my 5DIV) I started using it and still do. I've got Av on top wheel(index finger), Tv on the big wheel on the back and the third(new for R5, thumb) wheel for exp. comp.

 

[Jan1977]

I don't think that taking "test shots" and then seeing/explaining what different settings do, will learn a person much. I mean, sure, learn the theory but it's something very different from having a camera in your hands and trying to get the exposure right. I think it's through actually using a camera that you learn. And then it becomes kinda intuitive.

I remember when I had my Ricoh, a friend of mine lent me a book about the basics of photography. I read about exposure and DOF and subject separation and although I obviously understood what I read, it had little relevance to what happened when I actually picked up a camera. I had to experience it myself. I gave up photography back then as the whole process with film was not my thing. I bought the 40D in 2010 and then really learned how to properly expose my shots as the EXIF was embedded with each file. That was a tremendous help. But it still took many months before working the dials on the camera became a second nature, knowing instinctively almost which setting I wanted to change and why: aperture, shutter speed or ISO. You can't learn that from a book or a teacher, I don't think.

Since I have only shot in manual mode, I don't think I quite understand exposure compensation, so maybe I have this all wrong, but if you have to turn a dial to compensate for overexposure or underexposure for a given setting, then what is the difference with manual where you do the same?

I think that exposure compensation is more intended towards the semi-automated modes Tv and Av, where you only control 1 parameter. When in M-mode with shutterspeed and aperture set for the creative part of the exposure, you can either use auto-ISO and guide the camera with exposure compensation (only when the scene is overly bright or dark) or manual ISO.
If the scene is average, the auto-ISO can do well in M-mode which tends to be the case with almost all of my shooting. If I had to change the exposure compensation regularly in order to keep my camera choosing a proper ISO and when shooting in M-mode, I would rather set ISO manually.

 

[CraigMcM]

I haven't voted, and I vouch for Manual Mode.

This teaches so much of exposure alone.

You can learn a lot about it with film cameras, while it makes much more difference
with digital camera bodies in what you can do with the captured image.

 

[ImageMaker]

In studio, I always always always shoot completely manual (except for auto focus).

Outdoors, I’m 90% Aperture Priority.

The remaining 10% I’ll shoot manual with Auto ISO or some other mode depending on what’s going on. A photographer needs to understand and work all modes of a camera. You need the flexibility to adjust to situations as they present themselves. However, I never use (P)rofesional mode though ;-)

 

[tacphotog]

I began photography with the Asahi Pentax Spotmatic F. I loved the camera, except for the screw on lenses. It's a manual 35mm film camera and forces you to experiment with all of your settings to get the pictures you want. It made it easy with the view finder needle indicating correct exposure. It also made the stop down button a very important part of the camera for depth of field. I came to understand how things should work quickly and it gave me a big boost when I went to the Canon AE1, which was a big leap forward. I think manual mode is the way to go.